Hello
Consider that im spending 3 days now and i cand find a normal solution for changing the presets for VST instruments.And this is psychologically hard for me considering myself a software tweaker -):
If i use Preset manager,everything is so slow,i cant go from sound to sound in the same vsti and from vsti to vsti.
The setup is pretty much like this
4 or 5 Vsti (Kore2,minimoog,The grand,Albino2) and i want to be able to play diferent instruments from my keyboard in live stage.i have tried to load the instruments in all possible ways, in grid mode,in rack mode,in All mode, in the same patch even.Tried to memorise the different sounds in conductor or even preset manager,but i got always the same condition. it passes 1 or 2 seconds until the sound is changed when i PC in my Master keyboard.This is not good in live when you got to change from sound to sound very fast.
Any solution or sugestion.I want to be able to use the different instruments and even their internal libraries,being able to organize them as i wish,changing the row,changing a sound easily if i dont like it from the preset,and all this from my Program change through my master keyboard.
Waiting....
Waiting...........
Waiting.....................
VSTi preset change what is the best solution?
It sounds like you are using some VSTI's with large sample based etc. libraries that must be loaded from disk when you change presets.
Without having tried the VSTI's you are using, I think you may be be limited to the speed of your computer for how fast these types of presets can load.
One thing you might try is setting up a continuous loop recorder to capture a couple of bars of your master mix and linking this to a preset manager preset selection so that everytime you load a preset the loop kicks in for the time needed and fills the space..?
You could also try using a seperate preset manager for each VSTI and not changing all of the presets for all of the VSTI's at the same time.
Without having tried the VSTI's you are using, I think you may be be limited to the speed of your computer for how fast these types of presets can load.
One thing you might try is setting up a continuous loop recorder to capture a couple of bars of your master mix and linking this to a preset manager preset selection so that everytime you load a preset the loop kicks in for the time needed and fills the space..?
You could also try using a seperate preset manager for each VSTI and not changing all of the presets for all of the VSTI's at the same time.
thanks Gurulogic for your reply
No my machine is not slow considering quad core xeon 2.8 procesor,4 gigs of ram,the best nvidia range graphic adapter motu 828mk2 firewire sound etc.And its not the problem of large sound libraries because all the instruments are loaded in ram first and then recalled.And that happened even for Albino or Minimog whic uses no samples,only synthesis.I tried the simplest way,recording mute switch actions in the preset manager.Mute 3 instruments and unmute the first,then mute the first unmute the second and so on.I think this is pretty simple and not Cpu demanding.And if i understand you correct your master mix way is when you are doing sequencing.If so im not doing sequencing for the moment.Im just using Usine as a Live mixer,a drum trigger (from my acoustic drums to midi drums through audio to midi modules) effect processor etc.No sequencing
My Cpu loads in 10 percent and my Ram at 50 Percent,so my machine not even feels the weight
Any other idea? im going crazy thinking that the simplest thing to do results in so much pain
thanks for all,waiting from you
regards
No my machine is not slow considering quad core xeon 2.8 procesor,4 gigs of ram,the best nvidia range graphic adapter motu 828mk2 firewire sound etc.And its not the problem of large sound libraries because all the instruments are loaded in ram first and then recalled.And that happened even for Albino or Minimog whic uses no samples,only synthesis.I tried the simplest way,recording mute switch actions in the preset manager.Mute 3 instruments and unmute the first,then mute the first unmute the second and so on.I think this is pretty simple and not Cpu demanding.And if i understand you correct your master mix way is when you are doing sequencing.If so im not doing sequencing for the moment.Im just using Usine as a Live mixer,a drum trigger (from my acoustic drums to midi drums through audio to midi modules) effect processor etc.No sequencing
My Cpu loads in 10 percent and my Ram at 50 Percent,so my machine not even feels the weight
Any other idea? im going crazy thinking that the simplest thing to do results in so much pain
thanks for all,waiting from you
regards
In Sound We Trust
Ok, then there must be something else wrong because preset changes should be near instant in most cases. For example, if I make an empty patch with Eckel VST sending midi to Massive, and I load several loops in another sample based VSTI (Molar)and then make a few variations saved in a preset manager, including new loops in Molar, my preset changes are instant.Mind you, I do run a triple drive raid 0 stripe array so that significantly speeds up loading loops from disk.
The only other thing that I can think of is maybe if you have an antivirus monitoring your system that could be slowing things down? Otherwise, do you have enough RAM and your computer isn't swapping heavily?
The only other thing that I can think of is maybe if you have an antivirus monitoring your system that could be slowing things down? Otherwise, do you have enough RAM and your computer isn't swapping heavily?
uhh i mentioned 4 gigs of ram above,shouldnt it be enough for merely changing presets?And yes i do have Norton monitoring my system,but never experienced an antivirus probing the internal functions of a software like mutes,soloing etc.Those are pretty basic ond not thinkable as harmful!And i noticed that this happens only when i recall presets with preset manager or conductor.If i build a patch for plus minus buttons to navigate through the internal presets of a vsti,then the change is instant.It shouldnt be if the AV is monitoring the system.
So you are telling me that you dont have any of the problems described
Maybe than it should be my PC a little overinstalled a lot of progs,maybe system in general is slowed or smth is conflicting with usine in my system...i dont know
And Again i dont have the same problem of preset change in Nuendo,Core2 Standalone etc This is pretty basic operation..
Any other idea or i should start the pain in the a...s procedure of a fresh windows install and test every new software for possible conflicts debuging etc etc
Damn..i got a year work in my Pc.to much pain
Thanks Guru
So you are telling me that you dont have any of the problems described
Maybe than it should be my PC a little overinstalled a lot of progs,maybe system in general is slowed or smth is conflicting with usine in my system...i dont know
And Again i dont have the same problem of preset change in Nuendo,Core2 Standalone etc This is pretty basic operation..
Any other idea or i should start the pain in the a...s procedure of a fresh windows install and test every new software for possible conflicts debuging etc etc
Damn..i got a year work in my Pc.to much pain
Thanks Guru
In Sound We Trust
I assume you have also tried with a brand new empty workspace / patch?
I definately don't have the same problems. The only last thing I can think of is to boot into safe mode and try there to see if there is any software conflict, except I don't think Usine's engine will allow a patch to activate with no ASIO driver selected.
For myself personally, I never go much more than 6 months on an OS install because it always seems to start to rot away and perform poorly or behave strange...it would suck though to do a reinstall and not have your problem resolved. Of course you could always backup an image of your current OS partition first, which everyone should really be doing anyways..it takes me less than 5 minutes to recover from any OS disaster or a boring test install of windows.
I definately don't have the same problems. The only last thing I can think of is to boot into safe mode and try there to see if there is any software conflict, except I don't think Usine's engine will allow a patch to activate with no ASIO driver selected.
For myself personally, I never go much more than 6 months on an OS install because it always seems to start to rot away and perform poorly or behave strange...it would suck though to do a reinstall and not have your problem resolved. Of course you could always backup an image of your current OS partition first, which everyone should really be doing anyways..it takes me less than 5 minutes to recover from any OS disaster or a boring test install of windows.
Yes of course i tried even with a fresh empty workspace just only 3 Vsti loaded and the same.i dont kow,,i will try the backup solution and fresh os reinstall.Maybe this will resolve the problem.I will make you know after that
Thanks
Thanks
In Sound We Trust
Just an idea:
As far as I've understood you're doing the preset changes via a program change command from your Midi keyboard ?
If so, maybe your Midi keyboard is slow sending out the program changes ? (mine is sometimes, taking 1 or 2 seconds to send out, Evolution MK-416C).
To test this you could (temporarily) assign some presets to keys on your keyboard (via conductor/preset manager and Midi learn) and trigger them via Note on messages instead of PC messages and see if this changes anything (just to narrow down the culprit for a start...)
As far as I've understood you're doing the preset changes via a program change command from your Midi keyboard ?
If so, maybe your Midi keyboard is slow sending out the program changes ? (mine is sometimes, taking 1 or 2 seconds to send out, Evolution MK-416C).
To test this you could (temporarily) assign some presets to keys on your keyboard (via conductor/preset manager and Midi learn) and trigger them via Note on messages instead of PC messages and see if this changes anything (just to narrow down the culprit for a start...)
Yes a midi master keyboard.Yamaha S80,but no problem with other software just with usine.And it happens even when i recall preset 0 recall 1 recall 2 with mouse.it takes something more than 1 sec for the sound to change.I tried the idea of gurulogic to give a try booting in safe mode,and yes usine opens normaly but with no audio/midi drivers loaded.Even that doesnt resolve the problem.the change speed is the same.you cant switch fast from sound to sound.i see the mouse pointer work (the sand clock) one time,than a small moment again and then the sound is changed
any idea?I got winxp sp3 i will try to make a screen capture of the whole thing and send it via a link
Thanks Nofish and Guru for spending your time
any idea?I got winxp sp3 i will try to make a screen capture of the whole thing and send it via a link
Thanks Nofish and Guru for spending your time
In Sound We Trust
Try a Create Midi module connected to a Midi to Usine module and then learn the preset change from that. If it works internally like this with no problem then perhaps Usine has a problem with your midi interface...?
Also, Pizmidi makes a great midi program change VST that may be usefull with the Midi to Usine for testing: http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=192282
Also, I always use CC's for switching presets, not Program Change so I suppose there could be an issue with PC's that I would not have noticed.
Edit: I just re-read your problem, and it even happens when switching with a mouse so I guess my ideas are probably no good..
Edit Edit: What you're describing is what happens if I say for example load Bidule in Usine and then load VST's into Bidule. If I recall a preset of Bidule hosting a VST, it seems as though Bidule needs to reload the VST from disk resulting in a delay. I would imagine the behavior would be the same with Kore....? But I would assume that you are not loading all your VSTI's in Kore first?
Also, Pizmidi makes a great midi program change VST that may be usefull with the Midi to Usine for testing: http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=192282
Also, I always use CC's for switching presets, not Program Change so I suppose there could be an issue with PC's that I would not have noticed.
Edit: I just re-read your problem, and it even happens when switching with a mouse so I guess my ideas are probably no good..
Edit Edit: What you're describing is what happens if I say for example load Bidule in Usine and then load VST's into Bidule. If I recall a preset of Bidule hosting a VST, it seems as though Bidule needs to reload the VST from disk resulting in a delay. I would imagine the behavior would be the same with Kore....? But I would assume that you are not loading all your VSTI's in Kore first?
no,not in Kore.I use it only for 3 or 4 sounds that i like.
i tried another way with all the vst in different tracks.Each Vst has a 8xpreset manager(to store my favorite Sounds)and the mutes for each instrument(track) are stored in conductor.BUT i realize that conductor will not record preset manager operations.In other words,if i store three different sounds from albino2 (stored in preset manager First) the Conductor will not recall them.It recalls only the grid functions like mute,bypass, volumes etc,but not internal presets from vsti and even those stored in the preset manager.
i tried another way with all the vst in different tracks.Each Vst has a 8xpreset manager(to store my favorite Sounds)and the mutes for each instrument(track) are stored in conductor.BUT i realize that conductor will not record preset manager operations.In other words,if i store three different sounds from albino2 (stored in preset manager First) the Conductor will not recall them.It recalls only the grid functions like mute,bypass, volumes etc,but not internal presets from vsti and even those stored in the preset manager.
In Sound We Trust
Lets explain the situation from another point of view
What would you have done if:
1-you have 4 VSTi and wanted 3or4 internal presets from them
2-you have another host as Kore2 inside Usine
3-you want to add after some time another instrument in the preset manager(you just purchased a new sample based vsti)
4-you want to replace or add after you finished recording presets with preset manager,another sound in Kore2
What is the best solution for organising that scenario.Im not mentioning the 2sec delay in preset switching
if you want to add a new samplebased instrument in the list,you should restore all the presets in the preset manager,because the preset manager will recall the old sample each time you switch a preset(even if the sampler is in bypass mode in the recalled preset)
So each time you have to add or change a timbre you have to rewrite all the presets.....
Tell me if another solution exists..im still not finding it.This way is very stressy
Thanks again
What would you have done if:
1-you have 4 VSTi and wanted 3or4 internal presets from them
2-you have another host as Kore2 inside Usine
3-you want to add after some time another instrument in the preset manager(you just purchased a new sample based vsti)
4-you want to replace or add after you finished recording presets with preset manager,another sound in Kore2
What is the best solution for organising that scenario.Im not mentioning the 2sec delay in preset switching
if you want to add a new samplebased instrument in the list,you should restore all the presets in the preset manager,because the preset manager will recall the old sample each time you switch a preset(even if the sampler is in bypass mode in the recalled preset)
So each time you have to add or change a timbre you have to rewrite all the presets.....
Tell me if another solution exists..im still not finding it.This way is very stressy
Thanks again
In Sound We Trust
If you connect a fader etc. to the num input of a preset manager you can then store the fader value in the conductor to recall the preset. This is just one way...
oh a big yes
i Was just trying now,but not with a fader but a list box.it works.And the final way for me will be:
All vsti loaded in RAck All mode(to make possible layered sounds)
Inside each Vsti patch a 8x preset manager with presets for each vsti
the conductor records the bypass actions on the Rack.
if i want to change a sound later,i change it in the preset manager of the selected vsti only
Thanks Guru,you has been helpful
i Was just trying now,but not with a fader but a list box.it works.And the final way for me will be:
All vsti loaded in RAck All mode(to make possible layered sounds)
Inside each Vsti patch a 8x preset manager with presets for each vsti
the conductor records the bypass actions on the Rack.
if i want to change a sound later,i change it in the preset manager of the selected vsti only
Thanks Guru,you has been helpful
In Sound We Trust
I am glad it is working for you now! Strange...
It is also possible to have one listbox control many preset managers. You could set it up so that one listbox goes to each VSTI subpatch and then when you enable the patch, the current preset would be recalled.
As well, you could put a Pass if Change module before each preset manager and have a second listbox controlled by a different CC for each subpatch that would alternatively allow you to change individual VSTI presets independant of the others.
You might find my Preset Manager x128 patch in Add Ons >Others usefull for what you are doing?
It is also possible to have one listbox control many preset managers. You could set it up so that one listbox goes to each VSTI subpatch and then when you enable the patch, the current preset would be recalled.
As well, you could put a Pass if Change module before each preset manager and have a second listbox controlled by a different CC for each subpatch that would alternatively allow you to change individual VSTI presets independant of the others.
You might find my Preset Manager x128 patch in Add Ons >Others usefull for what you are doing?
i downloaded you presetx128 but i dont know how to put it work.i press store but nothing happeens.And your list box with a different CC proposal is not my case,as my Keyboard doesnt have many buttons for CC.Only Program Change(in fact its true that if i filter Programchange with a midi filter i got a CC Number As result)
In Sound We Trust
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